#43 - Wendy's Lived Experience

Welcome to the School Can't Experience Podcast hosted by Leisa Reichelt. In this episode, Wendy, a high school teacher and foster parent, shares her story of caring for her foster son Jax, who has struggled with school attendance for several years.

Wendy shares the various challenges they have faced with the education system, their experiences with foster care, and their journey towards finding an appropriate learning environment for Jax where he is now truly seen, understood and supported. 

The episode also highlights the importance of understanding neurodiversity and advocating for children with special needs.

Content warning: the episode includes a mention of suicide. Please listen with care and reach out for support if you need it.

00:00 Welcome to the School Can't Experience Podcast

00:27 Introducing Wendy and Her Story

01:16 Wendy's Background and Family Dynamics

04:45 Challenges in the Education System

08:55 Navigating the Foster Care System

16:12 Breakthroughs and Progress

23:21 Finding the Right School

29:47 Reflections and Future Hopes

33:52 Closing Remarks and Resources

People & resources mentioned in this episode:

• NSW In-Home Care - https://nswihc.org.au/in-home-care/
• Your Child is Not Broken: Parent Your Neurodivergent Child Without Losing Your Marbles, by Heidi Mavir  - https://www.panmacmillan.com.au/9781035030576/

Transcript

Leisa Reichelt: 0:05

Hello and welcome to the School Can't Experience Podcast. I'm Leisa Reichelt, and this podcast is brought to you by the School Can't Australia community. Caring for a young person who's struggling to attend school can be a stressful and isolating experience, but you are not alone. Thousands of parents across Australia and many more around the world face similar challenges and experiences every day. Today we have Wendy joining us to share her lived experience of School Can't. Wendy is a high school teacher and has been a foster parent to her son Jax for about seven years. In many ways, their experience is going to sound very familiar to our School Can't families, but with the added complexity of involvement with state and agencies as a part of that foster care relationship. Quick content warning. This episode does include a brief reference to suicide, so please listen with care and reach out for support if you need it. I hope you enjoy our conversation. Thank you so much, Wendy, for joining us for our podcast today. Really appreciate you being willing to come and share your story.

Wendy: 1:03

My pleasure. The community's given a lot to us and without it, we wouldn't have successfully navigated where we've been. So thank you and thank you to everyone who is part of the group as well.

Leisa Reichelt: 1:16

Let us get started by getting to know you and your family a little bit, Wendy, can you tell us a little bit about you and, your family?

Wendy: 1:25

Yeah, look, I'm a single parent. I have foster son who came to me when he was little. When I look back, I can see signs that probably should have foreshadowed this more. But then we had some concerns with a friendship breakdown at school and some little things. We'd had some reactive behaviors and some suspensions, not many, and then, it all sort of blew up.

Leisa Reichelt: 1:52

And Wendy, you are an educator as well?

Wendy: 1:55

Yes, yes. I believe in education. I believe in public education. However, I understand that it is not always appropriate. This has been a great learning curve for me as well. And I find neuropsychology fascinating. So, I have grown a great deal as an educator. I have changed a lot in my classroom, to accommodate, needs of other children and just sort of a little bit more aware as well.

Leisa Reichelt: 2:24

What ages do you teach?

Wendy: 2:26

I'm a high school teacher, and my room is in the noisiest and busiest part of the school. Throughout learning about my son, I came to the realization and got a diagnosis that I am ADHD. So middle aged, with an ADHD diagnosis. But you know what, when I could see things in my son and others could not, I now understand why. Because I guess in some ways we are wired similarly. And I could see, oh, that's concerning him. And when I try to explain that with expert advice, other people would be like, oh, no, no, no. That's not the case. Learning about things like sensitivities and sound and texture and all the rest of it, you know, it's not just being fussy, it is about cognitive overload as well. I'm trying very hard to make sure that I make that difference for kids in my classroom as well. I've also learned things like there are certain types of questions that we think are easier for children. So matching things up, words and definitions that is actually adding to the stress and strain of cognitive overload. And I've brought that back to my teaching and to the people I work with as well to say, guys, this is not friendly. It would be better to have a question and an answer because there are too many steps to this as well, which is interesting, I think as well.

Leisa Reichelt: 3:52

How have you learned that? Have you gone out and done additional professional development or is this your own personal learning that you've been doing?

Wendy: 4:00

A bit of both. My son has some specialists that he works with. I have talked through with them different scenarios and also I do a lot of reading. When things are mentioned to me, I then go out and seek and read and learn. So I found some great books. Firstly I learnt about trauma because having a child with trauma, that was very important for me. And then, with the ASD diagnosis, I've always tried to learn, so that I am doing best practice in my life wherever I can. I have found it very interesting. And so it has been through both my job but also through my son is learning about that and joining communities and web pages and reading professional articles as well.

Leisa Reichelt: 4:45

Well, why don't we go back to the beginning. Wherever you think the beginning is of Jax School Can't experience and your exposure to School Can't. You said that, looking back, there were probably some early indicators.

Wendy: 4:58

yeah.

Leisa Reichelt: 4:58

do you think it all starts?

Wendy: 5:00

Well, he came to me halfway through kindergarten and the policy is that children go to school as soon as they can when they're in your care. Now, hindsight for me says, a best practice would be creating connections first and then slowly. But I know that we, as we all know, there are bigger forces at play than us that sometimes you don't always get to decide. So when I took him for his orientation, I think of it now and I am saddened to think this little boy was in the fetal position in the corner of the office waiting room. Thinking about that now, I understand that school wasn't safe. I have learned more recently that he was removed from a family member's care, a second removal from his preschool and that was quite tumultuous. So I imagine that school is associated with trauma, even if he doesn't realize it. Going back to kindergarten, I now can see things like that. However, we did successfully transition. He had an amazing kindie teacher who saw his spark and his joy of life and all the rest of it. In year one, we also had a great teacher. However, as I said, my son is reactive at times. He did get suspended in year one, and that was absolutely devastating. Now, as an educator, I, understood that there were things that have to happen. However, I think he had two suspensions, maybe three from year one to five. He was absolutely broken by that suspension. We talked it through, we did what have you. He wasn't punished for that. He reacted to another child and I think he might've hit them. With my knowledge now I know that reactive behavior was, you know, we call it a meltdown. The sense that we couldn't express ourselves. And I think there's no space for children who are emotionally younger than their peers. And that's difficult. And I guess we can talk about that idea of invisible disabilities. I still see so much misunderstanding from psychologists. I read a great book. I can't remember what it is, it was a British woman, and it was amazing, and she swore a lot as well, which, resonated with me. it talked about her son, the exposure therapy and the damage it had on her son. Now, obviously we went through the exposure therapy and all the rest of it. What I'm thinking is that people are not understanding that misbehavior is not always misbehavior. We look at the action and what's happened, but we haven't seen what that lead up is.

Leisa Reichelt: 7:47

Can I ask at the, at the stage that he was getting these suspensions, had he been identified as autistic yet, or not yet?

Wendy: 7:55

No. Mental health means a lot to me. I lost a parent to suicide. And knowing background and history and story, I was going to do my darndest that any child in my care was going to be supported with everything. Now that has been a big fight, but we started with a counselor. We moved to a psychologist. Then in my reading I read that a psychologist and a psychiatrist is often very good for mental health because you need both parts. We talk a lot about the window of tolerance and what have you, but if a child skill wise cannot access this because cognitive overload or whatever, then that's where the psychiatrist can help with medication to allow a window that we can work with and create strategies. So I did that. I got a lot of pushback because I'm not the legal parent. And I have to get permission for everything. But we did it.

Leisa Reichelt: 8:55

In that situation, are you getting permission from the state?

Wendy: 8:57

Yes. The state has given private companies the power. Now I have to seek permission for many, many things. And I'm not called a parent. I have a great relationship with Jax biological family. We do very well, but, I have been repeatedly told that I'm an employee and I'm not his parent. And that's hard.

Leisa Reichelt: 9:24

And how long have you been caring for him?

Wendy: 9:26

Over seven years,

Leisa Reichelt: 9:28

Wow.

Wendy: 9:29

Anyway, I have to work within a system and I understand that. But I don't know if there is respect both ways in that regard. When I advocate, I think it's seen as problematic. I do my best. We had a lovely speechie who suggested that Jax may be neurodivergent. He likes scary things and apparently that's a very common autistic trait. And impulsive, and absolutely wonderful, beautiful. But, I mentioned that and I was told no. No testing, Anyway, when we got this lovely psychiatrist on board who's been amazing, and a great team there. Jax was probably always about an 80% attendance kid. Needed rest time, needed mental health times, particularly after times of change. So any change is difficult. Going into and out of holidays. We would do our best, but, if he needed time, I would give him time. He had developed his first really firm friendship in year four, a new child at school. I was feeling pretty excited. We went on holidays together. The mother was a psychologist. The child was neurodivergent, very fast, strong friendship. And then it stopped. I'd, talked to the mum and said, can we get the boys into figure this out. The mum didn't force the issue. I still don't know what the concern was as such, and my boy spiraled from there. So, unfortunately, I think my boy was a scapegoat a lot at school. You know, the child that you know how to push their buttons. Jack started running away from school. And that was very difficult. I would get calls daily at the end of year five. I ended up cutting school short that year by two weeks, thinking that would work. Sorry, that was the end of year four. Anyway, fresh start in year five, brand new teacher to the school. They both had an interest in soccer. For a second that worked. I think we made three days and then we stopped going altogether. The teacher had a loud voice, loud voices, male voices is a trigger. Jax has had stronger connections with females in the past, in caregivers and what have you. We tried, but it wasn't working. It went into crisis mode. Our caseworker was coming. At first I tried to get him to school to the best of my ability. It wasn't working. I threw my hands up. I'd already used all my long service and sick leave. So we had school not feeling safe. Home was safe to a point. We had his caseworker then, the rhetoric was that I was too soft.

Leisa Reichelt: 12:24

Because you weren't forcing him to school?

Wendy: 12:26

Yes, yes, yes. Now, so we had the caseworker coming in daily to force him to school. He'd run away. I remember distinctly one morning at 8:30, calling in sick to work. My son has run away. Luckily my work has been so very good about that. And the more the push happened, the worse it became. And my son went from accessing the house to being bound to his bedroom. If it happened again, there is no way I would allow that. And I ended up stepping in. We had a great psychologist at that time. We ended up having a plan where a support person would come, and try to get him to school and would do the paperwork and packages from school and once a day or once a week, he'd have to bring the work in. The rhetoric started from then, that my son was addicted to gaming. And home was, and I know everyone can relate to this was too comfortable. So, well, he did have a TV and a PlayStation in his bedroom that was removed. Then, there was an application made to turn the internet off until he had done what he was asked to do every day. And it breaks my heart to think of this again. My son then dumped a whole bunch of technology in the pool As I said, this is a boy in crisis. When I reported that to our agency, they laughed. Nothing was replaced, whatever. I complied to the best of my ability, as did the support worker. Until the support worker said, I can't do this anymore. This is against my job description. At first they bought the rhetoric that was around me and my family, and then they realized that wasn't the case. So, fast forward a little bit, we were making some progress, then because my son could not meet deadlines. As we know, a lot of kids can't. The funding was withdrawn. We no longer had a support worker. I was told that he goes to school or deal with it.

Leisa Reichelt: 14:37

So the deadlines were you had to produce this amount of work in this much time type deadlines?

Wendy: 14:43

With all the restrictive practices.get dressed get the work done and then deliver it to the school. So that, exposure therapy sort of thing. He found that very difficult. He ended up starting to wear all black and hoodie. For years, that's all we would wear. We did our best with that. Then, the funding was withdrawn. He didn't make the deadline, that psychologist was then sacked. I was left with a child who would not leave their room for anything really. And I had no care, no nothing. So I started to employ private sitters, which I did for a long time, and got myself into some financial difficulty, which I'm still crawling out of today. Luckily, my, brother-in-law had some time off work and for the last term of year five, I think it was, I would drop my son there every day and he would spend the day there and that was great. And, that helped us out an awful lot. Then going into year six the incessant meetings, we had a very good school liaison officer, a very good public school, and they were doing their darndest and they knew I was doing my darndest. Our agency did not believe that, and, they wiped their hands of it. Somewhere in this time between five and six, I feel like I've lost probably three years of our life. Our psychiatrist, pulled in a favor and got an autism diagnosis for Jax. Which was great. So that was, then added to the other diagnosis. And, can I say it didn't make a difference in how people responded. However, it made a difference for me in learning about how he ticks. He probably isn't stereotypical. But definitely there are, particularly sensory issues there. Now we all know that COVID probably, made this process of burnout happen quicker because we felt what it was like not to have that conformity every day. If that makes sense. You know, and the explosions in the afternoon and all the rest of it.

Leisa Reichelt: 16:57

So having that contrast, you mean between the usual daily demands and then COVID, taking a lot of those demands away helps you to see the difference between how your son was in one context versus another.

Wendy: 17:11

I don't have to mask or conform all day or, feel the pressures of that. He still doesn't like crowds. But he will do crowds for things that he likes, and we are better in so many ways in that regard, because we can manage it a bit more. We understand it now and we work together. When we got the diagnosis a friend was going through a similar issue, with an older child. She recommended me to the School Can't Facebook page which was wonderful for me because I would scroll the pages nightly. Through the webpage and people's stories I learned about in-home care, which, really did save our family in a lot of ways.

Leisa Reichelt: 17:52

So tell me more about that.

Wendy: 17:53

Yeah, well our agency is still ignorant of that. Even despite my best, I applied for it. I got the paperwork in and all the rest of it. I kept the agency abreast of all of this and we were approved. Wow. It was amazing. The problem was there weren't really suitable carers. So we went through the first worker. We then got two other workers who I thought would've been a good fit. One of them was training to be a social worker, but the connection wasn't there. Then the agency I worked with went bust. So I had to take time off work to look after my son. I ended up finding a new, not local, but a new in-home care agency, that one of the carers agreed to come with us. And that was a stop gap. Wasn't a great fit, but it was better than nothing until one day they just decided to quit

Leisa Reichelt: 18:51

All these solutions are just so temporary, aren't they?

Wendy: 18:54

It's just devastating and it's another change, another hiccup. We were left for some time and, the agency, they were advertising and all the rest of it. I put ads in the university, I canvassed everywhere I could. There was nowhere. But then one of the lovely people at our agency suggested someone who might be interested and, by the grace of God or what have you, this person said they'd come and see. Jax had a first great day, and this person clicked. She wouldn't let him get away with things, but she was warm. Great sense of humor, little bit dark if she needed. Understanding that a child 11, 12, 13, He's not a little child. Luckily this person is still working with us today, two years later. So, In home care, we then had to figure out what was going to happen. The ultimatum was that for year seven, I had been advocating, I had been going to all these meetings and the decision was made, it would be distance education or it'd be the local high school, which is where I work. That was it. So distance education it was going to be. I thought I could supervise his education and our in-home care worker could be here every day. That was a breach of law. I didn't know that. So distance ed was pulled out from underneath us, just like that.

Leisa Reichelt: 20:31

How is that a breach of law?

Wendy: 20:32

In home care, you can't do Distance Ed. The person cannot be the manager. And I didn't know that. Homeschooling yes, but not that. And so it got very messy from then on. We really were at the end of our tether, So, we were making great strides at home with a consistent educator who got him and all the rest of it. They weren't necessarily always seen for what they were. I would take photos daily of the setup that I had, the work that was left. I would take photos of everything, but at the end of year six, when Distance Ed was pulled out from underneath us and I tried to advocate anywhere I could, another risk of harm was put in for our family that I had to answer to the Department of Communities and Justice for medical and educational neglect.

Leisa Reichelt: 21:28

Oh my God.

Wendy: 21:29

The medical neglect was that Jax didn't have a psychologist at that time. That was because the agency had withdrawn that psychologist. The educational neglect, I asked about homeschooling, if we could do that for a bit. No. So I had to answer to all this, even though those decisions were not my decisions. I had floated the idea of an alternate private school from about year four when I noticed that as other children were advancing in different ways, my foster son was still emotionally immature. Depression, anxiety, trauma, PTSD, all these things made it difficult for him. I was not allowed to apply for this school. And so that was that. Now, because Distance Ed was taken off the table and I had to sit down and actually, the agency and DCJ did speak to my son and said, you go to school or you can't live here anymore. I wish I could have protected him from that as well. I mean, what do you do? I am so very lucky that didn't happen. However, the threats were huge. There was a suggestion that he would go live elsewhere throughout the week, whether he could be made to go to school and come to me on the weekend.

Leisa Reichelt: 22:59

It must be stressful for both of you.

Wendy: 23:00

Oh yeah, it, it was, I was losing my mind. Now they were mental health concerns for me, and I, in this process was then diagnosed as, neurodivergent with ADHD, peri-menopausal woman. You know how it goes. My psychiatrist said, you're not going insane. This is stress. You're under immense stress.

Leisa Reichelt: 23:20

how did we get out of this? Because ultimately, this is a happy story, right?

Wendy: 23:24

The great thing was with no other choice through the agency and DCJ, we got permission to apply for a school, a private school that focuses in on children that are neurodivergent, anxiety, depression, all of that. So we did that. We had an uphill first week, one hour a day, second week, two hours a day, third week, three hours a day, you get it. So by week five, it was full days. It was really stressful because there were signs of strain and by now we had another psychologist on board, the psychiatrist, the in-home care, myself. We asked. We're seeing strain. Can we stop at two hours a day? No. Okay. So we didn't make it every day. There was then another meeting that if we have any more absences, then that's it. Anyway, all back and forth, we got through. We still have absences. I think we're about 79, 80% attendance. Probably once a fortnight. We might need some time, but we are making full days.

Leisa Reichelt: 24:42

What is so different about this school? Why is he able to attend this school in a way that he wasn't the others?

Wendy: 24:47

It's very small. There are two classes of maybe 15 kids, and they do it by stage. His teacher and support teacher are great. It starts with a movement break. It then goes into literacy and numeracy in those peak times in the morning. They don't cram into the day what traditional schools will. There is flexibility. They'll go to the beach, hang out at the beach. My son doesn't like that though'cause he wants to go swimming and what have you, and you can't do that. There is that understanding there. The classroom has flexible learning of where you can be and how. And it's also, the pace and the school is designed for kids who struggle. And my son has always traditionally struggled. Average intelligence, quite bright, great vocab, spelling, handwriting, nay.. The assessments are done at school. He's made a stop motion animation film at school. He made a CO2 dragster at school and he's made some tentative friendships. It took a long time for that. He's gone to two birthday parties. We haven't done that in years. I think we've been to very few birthday parties. And he's also now playing with his friends online with Minecraft and what have you. So the school has been amazing in that regard. I have tried to, if there's a concern let them know, And just to keep them in the loop, which has been great. And they've then fed back to me, how he's presented during these times too. They have been so understanding, that he can't come today and they're okay. Fair enough. Now, I went to his end of year, and I feel a bit removed'cause we still have in home care for the mornings. And the afternoons, so that way I can finish up at work. And I also do private tutoring to supplement paying for a private education. So we have in-home care so that can get him to an afternoon appointment. And it also makes sure that my son is not left by himself because that's detrimental to his mental health.

Leisa Reichelt: 27:01

Yeah.

Wendy: 27:01

The school, has been amazing in allowing him to grow. They were surprised by how, although he's limited in some skills and writing is difficult and spelling is difficult, that his knowledge and his reading and everything was good. And as they're going to learn and as he's opened up, they've realized that spelling really does hold him back and worries him. So if someone scribes for him, or, helps out in that way, then they get more. So that's been amazing They break up their day so that in the afternoons they are doing less taxing, less cognitive load, more fun things. The school day is not as long by a little bit. It's a little bit shorter. And, actually part of the school uniform is a black hoodie. How amazing is that?

Leisa Reichelt: 27:55

Perfect.

Wendy: 27:56

And he would wear a hoodie every day no matter what the weather. But now he doesn't need it so much.

Leisa Reichelt: 28:00

Yeah.

Wendy: 28:02

So that's been an absolute game changer, having all the team on board. We have a psychologist who they do some written work and that comes home and I get to look at it and my heart just skips a beat. One of them was, you know, how to be a good human, and he wrote down what things he needs to do or, what worries him. I found out that if I'm not home when I've said I'll be home, that causes him great anxiety. We're learning more about things like that as well. The end of school presentation I went to, he didn't want me to go. He was very nervous because you have to get up on stage, but not everyone did get up on stage. Some people couldn't do it that day, and that was okay. My son did get up and he got a class award as every child in the class did. And I was exceptionally proud.

Leisa Reichelt: 28:50

Yay.

Wendy: 28:51

You know, he didn't smile. He looked like he was on his death march, but that fine, it was just lovely.

Leisa Reichelt: 28:57

a typical teenage boy, isn't it?

Wendy: 28:59

Well that's what I think. They gave three class awards. My son got a class award, and I was like, oh my God, I wasn't even ready. I've got my camera out and what have you. And it was for growth and improvement. And then out of the school from year six to year 12, not a big school, as I said, but they gave four awards out. I didn't know this, the staff had to vote. That's how they do it. So two were year 12 students. My son in year seven got an award, sorry, I'm all goose bumpy, for perseverance and growth. And I am tickled pink because these people see my son. They know he's a really good boy and he has a really tough exterior, but that is protection. It has just been brilliant.

Leisa Reichelt: 29:46

So wonderful.

Wendy: 29:47

It is. It is a total success story, in that regard, and I do want people to know that is hope and there is alternatives. The amount of independent schools that are popping up are amazing. And maybe one doesn't fit, but one does. Also talking to people who have started to homeschool or unschool and people who have autonomy over their children. My son needed a three year break from the world. He needed to repair. And all the well-meaning advice we received wasn't great.

Leisa Reichelt: 30:23

It sounds like a lot of it did more harm than good, honestly.

Wendy: 30:25

Yeah. People and your nearest and dearest who you love are going to say, no, it's not right. However, I think you need to listen to what your child is telling you, even if they're not telling you with words. Avoid the shame spiral, avoid the, you know, the amount of plans we have canceled. I've lost friends, I've lost what have you. But what have we gained? We are celebrating so much at the moment. We've gone out for dinners. At restaurants and loved it. We've gone to see Back To The Future the musical, we've been to the movies, we've done this, we've done that. We've had people to the home and gone out and socialized in ways when he's comfortable. That is not every day though. And that's okay.

Leisa Reichelt: 31:10

it sounds like a huge change from when he was locked in his room in his black hoodie.

Wendy: 31:15

Yeah. It's fantastic. A year ago, I would never have said we were here, but we are here. I know there are parents who would laugh at that now. I would've laughed. I would've hated me now. Good for you. With things happening. I don't care about the awards. Please don't, please don't think that that is something that really got me impressed. The thing that I cared about is that he's seen, and that he's acknowledged and that his struggle has not been discounted. I hope that for everybody in that experience. In my mind, I keep saying there are children who never went to school, who grew up in wartime, and they were okay. And I know that, when he was not okay, he was watching financial advisor videos and he would come and show this is what we should do. It was an American, it wasn't going to help us. But he was learning, he was finding new skills, but we just didn't know that and we couldn't recognize it. And formal institutions couldn't see that. We all need to keep looking and also to keep being vocal because, I know that education system as a whole needs to change. I've invested in my own classroom to put shades over the fluorescent lighting because I would have a battle every day. I want the lights on, I want the lights off, I've got them now and we have the lights on and it's fine. Different things like that. hopefully people will see that if we can give a little. All children can feel empowered and strong enough to do what they need to do. Will they be in a mainstream school? I don't know. And that's okay. I'm just fortunate enough that I can work enough to afford the school we're going to. And I would like that for every child. And I think that's where we will be going soon. When we understand divergence, we need to have places that support in greater ways too. It might not be in my working lifetime But I'm seeing small changes, that I think there will be more.

Leisa Reichelt: 33:26

and you are a part of that change too. Wendy, thank you so much for what you're doing in that context as well. And thank you for being willing to come and share your story with us today. It's devastating to hear what you guys have had to go through, but it's wonderful that you're in a situation of transformation and hope right now.

Wendy: 33:44

Yeah.

Leisa Reichelt: 33:44

I'm really pleased to hear it.

Wendy: 33:45

Thank you. And please know that, although I may be a little bit time poor, whatever I can do to help the community, I will always do.

Leisa Reichelt: 33:52

How wonderful is it to hear that Jax has found somewhere that sees and understands him and that he's made so much progress back to wellbeing. And what a wonderful job has Wendy done in advocating for and supporting him. I hope you found this story inspiring. Wendy did send through the name of that book that flicked the light bulb for her, and it's called Your Child Is Not Broken, Parent Your Neurodivergent Child Without Losing Your Marbles by Heidi Mavir. I've put a link to it in the episode notes if that sounds like something you would like to check out. If you found our podcast helpful, I would be so grateful if you could take a moment to subscribe or maybe give us a rating or a review. It really does make a huge difference in helping us get the podcast in front of more people who have School Can't kids, and have not yet found our School Can't community and all the information that we share. If you have some feedback for us, or perhaps you've been inspired to share your own lived experience story, which would be amazing, please drop me an email to schoolcantpodcast@gmail.com. I would love to hear from you. If you are a parent or carer in Australia and you are feeling distressed, remember you can always call the Parent Help Line in your state or call Lifeline on 13 11 14. Thank you again for listening. We will talk again soon. Take care.